Deleted
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Op-Ed
Nov 14, 2008 13:01:33 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2008 13:01:33 GMT -5
I have tried very hard to stay away from responses such as this, but the commentary about me on the “related” board has been renewed and has become extremely personal, mean-spirited, and hurtful, some of it calling my character into question. I am at a loss to know what has prompted this latest round of vilification—I have posted only rarely here in the last few months and less over there—but after a seasonal hiatus the Merkel board’s “fred” seems to have been resurrected for a new round of objurgation. I don’t know if things are merely slow, but it now seems Mrs. Merkel—in all likelihood unhappy with her declining self-esteem—had only taken some time off to catch her breath and renew her vows of spite. That hiatus is apparently over and once more the LBHA and I have become the target of her wrath, though again, the latest casus belli escapes me. Her most recent diatribe includes new assaults on an old desert I had thought no one cared to enter any more—except maybe La Madame herself, and Boulder’s Panderer-in-Chief. For those of you who are familiar with this jacquerie, I offer some comment.
I don’t know why she dragged poor Jim Donovan into it; maybe it’s just a lack of proper obeisance. As for Mr. Donovan—a well-respected and rather good author—I don’t even know the man. I have never met him; I have never spoken to him; I have never written to him; and I have never submitted anything to him for publication or for representation. In fact, it would be presumptuous of me to think he might even recognize my name. If he has anything of mine he certainly didn’t get it from me. And knowing of Mrs. Merkel’s jealous streaks and her penchant for borrowing other’s abilities—[see, O. E. D.: viz., “fire-drill”]—anything she claims she has done for me couldn’t possibly have gotten as far as a submission to Donovan. Oh, and just for the record, despite the scurrilous innuendo, I left Mrs. Merkel’s Website seventeen days before learning of the LBHA award (May 27), so beware of timelines; I have the letter to prove it. No more drama there, Queenie.
I resent strongly the comments about Vietnam, though never having led anything in her life Mrs. Merkel has no capital impugning anything I have done. I doubt she even knows what the word “leadership” means; she certainly doesn’t exercise any with her contentious belching. Besides, medals provide testament to my contributions and I certainly do not need positive reinforcement from people who have spent their lives failing… or running… or pandering. As for foxholes, Mrs. Merkel flatters herself. I learned early on how unappetizing it is to spend any time in cramped quarters with dumpy, bandy-legged matrons who dye their roots black. It is clear to me that Matron Merkel is but a vindictive little sausage whose nova flared briefly but has dimmed because of poor decision-making brought about by sweaty insecurities. As for Darkcloud… his spine wouldn’t let him anywhere near a foxhole and his ego-driven cupidity has flung him into the arms of this louche, cyber-harpy. That’s about as close as he will ever get to experiencing danger. And the others? Please…! I’ve already cleaned my fingernails once today.
Not long ago my wife cautioned me about getting too involved with some of these slurry-headed crackpots. She proved correct. She also said, that just because someone says it, doesn’t make it true. My friends know the truth.
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Op-Ed
Nov 15, 2008 7:02:49 GMT -5
Post by strange on Nov 15, 2008 7:02:49 GMT -5
It took some time before I really understood how savage the dreaded Merkel board could be. I was wily in the first place, so I didn't really notice how the bickering attitude's were being sent into so many different directions.
The Stranger is also rather slow when it comes to receiving insults (because some insults are rather uplifting and complimentary, while others are spoken in a type of internet lingo which even I, as a youth, am unfamiliar with). I send my sincerest sympathies toward your plight and I hope they don't scar you too badly.
****
Sorry for going off subject. I think I'll retire for the morning.
*political commentary removed by mod. (Try to stay on topic Strange, politics is a very touchy subject to voice opinions on and it really has no place on the board here. It only tends to inflame passions. Thanks.)
The Moderator
Strange
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Op-Ed
Nov 16, 2008 6:18:51 GMT -5
Post by strange on Nov 16, 2008 6:18:51 GMT -5
Yeah, thanks for catching me. I've been really upset over the election of he-who-I'll-try-to-stop-mentioning.
Certain people on the other board also speak in rather unusual manners for people who say they're interested in Custer and Little Bighorn, or even war itself in general.
Some of you talked about being "military brats" (in one comment which I don't see anymore) and how you guys relate amongst yourselves. My family has served in the military off and on, but we aren't career people who live and grow on the bases (my uncle Larry was a real star in the navy, who could've soared to any rank he wished, but he got really angry when they told him he could not serve on a submarine. Due to the fact that he was 6'7" and over 320 pounds at his lightest.). We pretty much join when there's a war to fight and then go back to farming. I'm happy to say that I'm not a farm kid because MODERN farm kids and farm-ers in Iowa are some of the biggest arse-holes on the planet, along with most Iowans who take the money from their dead family members to buy 4-wheelers and trespass on every one's land as if they own the world (of coarse, I can't say my older neighbors are much better, because their damned grass-farming arse-hole of a grandfather likes to ride his Cadillac through our field like he's king Tut). My mother didn't farm grass, her hands are twice the size of a man's and they have stitches running through them. Its safe to say that I will be using my inherited brick hands to clobber all three generations of those spindly-necked, midget grass-farmers if I ever get a hold of some of those SOBs.
But anyway, I was relating how I wasn't a military brat, but I am a huge history buff. And I can't understand the thinking from some of the people on the other board because.....
1.They have feeble stomachs when it comes to blood and guts and bodies, but we ARE talking about battles here. We're also talking about combatants, sometimes not just from the Indians, who mutilate their opponents and bring home pieces of flesh from their enemies as trophies, or bounties, or sometimes to just be mean. 2. They despise Custer, and Custer lovers, which is unfortunate because HE'S THE CENTRAL FIGURE WE'RE DEALING WITH! Granted, I know there were many great soldiers and warriors to discuss, but no one can possibly have a fruitful discussion of Little Bighorn without mentioning the big cahoona.
I don't even think they behave like "Indian Buffs" either (at least, not an Indian War Buff). Their Indian threads don't have as much adventure in them (so far, we have rather underdeveloped threads in that category, but I did make some interesting posts). I am very fascinated with Indians ( I just enjoy the U.S. Army alot more, especially the Union army and Union veterans. If you think I'm ever being hard on Indians, you should peer into my brain and see what I'm usually thinking about the south). Being a fan of Blackbeard will immediately make you a fan of certain Indians if you're a guy who's interested in the art of battle dress and intimidation, along with individuality and great tales and stories from each individual (this is an area where I appreciate Indians more than whites. I like how they pay attention to each one on one experience rather than the general movements of an army. That'll leave a lot of work for some of you want the knowledge of the opposite, which is usually only accounted by whites........ most of whom could not make their voices heard on account of being dead).
All in all, I still had a fun time back when I was on the other board. And I wouldn't mind coming back if they could simply lift my ban. But I'm also very happy here and I congratulate you all for having a great sound mind and moderators who are VERY reasonable (thank you, very kindly!)
Strange
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Op-Ed
Nov 16, 2008 10:42:02 GMT -5
Post by conz on Nov 16, 2008 10:42:02 GMT -5
Yeah...I took my post off because I thought it was too personal, and I don't like talking about personalities.
Mainly I wanted to support my friend Fred...I hope he saw it, at least. If not, Fred, I've got your back. <G>
ConZ
PS...I like Donovan's work, too...its now my favorite.
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Op-Ed
Nov 16, 2008 12:45:56 GMT -5
Post by Melani on Nov 16, 2008 12:45:56 GMT -5
Strange, for me a lot of it can be summed up by Robert E. Lee's comment at Fredericksburg: "It is well that war should be so terrible, or else we would grow too fond of it." I have never gotten to the bottom of that--of course it's horrible and full of body parts and blood and guts, but here we all are studying it and even reenacting it. And everybody keeps doing it for real, throughout human history. There are some really fascinating aspects to that.
There's a great bit at the end of The Last Full Measure, by Jeff Shaara, describing Joshua Lawrence Chamberlain visiting Little Round Top for the last time before his death in 1914:
"He could hear the screams and the sounds of the muskets, could smell the hot burn of smoke, saw the terror in their eyes, and now he felt it, his mind opening to the marvelous memories, the pure raw excitement. If this was the last time, if he could never come back, he knew, seeing it all again, it was the most alive he had ever been."
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Op-Ed
Nov 16, 2008 14:20:55 GMT -5
Post by strange on Nov 16, 2008 14:20:55 GMT -5
Strange, for me a lot of it can be summed up by Robert E. Lee's comment at Fredericksburg: "It is well that war should be so terrible, or else we would grow too fond of it." I have never gotten to the bottom of that--of course it's horrible and full of body parts and blood and guts, but here we all are studying it and even reenacting it. And everybody keeps doing it for real, throughout human history. There are some really fascinating aspects to that. There's a great bit at the end of The Last Full Measure, by Jeff Shaara, describing Joshua Lawrence Chamberlain visiting Little Round Top for the last time before his death in 1914: "He could hear the screams and the sounds of the muskets, could smell the hot burn of smoke, saw the terror in their eyes, and now he felt it, his mind opening to the marvelous memories, the pure raw excitement. If this was the last time, if he could never come back, he knew, seeing it all again, it was the most alive he had ever been." I have never stepped foot on a battlefield. But if school-yard brawls have ever taught me anything, then it must be that fantastic moment when you catch the eyes of your opponent and time slows down to a crawl. By the time I got to high school, I was far from the energetic youngster I once was (and now am!). In those years my body was damaged, through no immediate fault of my own, and I was underweight, under nourished, both stickly limbed and a little bloated at the same time. And in those years, I staggered drunkardly through all advents and everybody was talking at me and pulling me every which way and wondering "what should be done of this sickly kid?". So onward I went forth, and I picked some fights with a childhood nemesis from my even younger years. And that kid was what I thought I should've been and he too remembered that I was far more vital in the years before (by now, my reputation had been dragged through the ringer and I was just returning to my old town.... a Stranger to most people who knew me, including immediate family members). And there I angered my nemesis, and I called a fight, and kids made a circle, and I arrived with my chest length hair and tattered black leather vest........ and the fight began...... and I just let him plow my face with his knuckles. The Stranger was too far gone at that time to really put up a strategy. I just liked being in there, in the thick of it. The highlight of the moment was how I could feel my "battle senses" blink on where everything slows down and time is altered. So I took the punches, and I deserved them because I rallied the fight. I didn't stay in as long as I wanted to because I felt disgraced by my brother standing on the side line and, instead of rooting me, just waiting for me walk out and admit I was "no tough guy". So thats what I did (except I didn't "admit" anything), I wasn't feeling tired or injured but I couldn't land one punch and no one was cheering me. And so, I went several times just like that....... for a long time. Until finally the Stranger quit school and soared 6 inches in height, and 70 pounds in muscle (albeit rather husky until I was sculpted to a better looking 210 pounds which I'm currently holding.). No one would ever fight with me now, even if I wanted them to. People in Iowa will never take their chances unless they have a guarantee of winning, and there's no guarantee of winning a fight against a squarely built man who stands 6'1" 210 pounds (not to mention some one who walks through blizzards in tight underwear and has the capability of lifting 4-500 pounds). Even Hulk Hogan (who clearly has alot of size and strength over me) is simply not some one who'd take his chances with some one. He's been in the thick of back-door feuds with several individuals who are much smaller than him, but he won't jump on it. Also, in Iowa we have a lot of fat people who's big finish is to sit on people. Once you deprive them of that comfort, they are pretty much dead in their socks (though many fat people in Iowa are rather strong). So thats my reasoning and how I'd understand those feelings which are boasted from the gallant hearts of people like Custer, Robert E. Lee, Patton, etc. Of coarse, I'll probably never be in the army. Due to the-elected-official-who-I-must-stop-mentioning. Strange
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Op-Ed
Nov 17, 2008 3:49:15 GMT -5
Post by strange on Nov 17, 2008 3:49:15 GMT -5
Here's an audio interview with Ty Cobb and some rare footage to go along with it. He's talking about baseball, but he's sort of preaching the jist of everything I believe in when facing any opponent..... watch the eye....
Strange
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Deleted
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Op-Ed
Nov 17, 2008 14:34:35 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2008 14:34:35 GMT -5
Clair--
I appreciate what you have said and I will not forget it. There is no question that I have over-reacted at times, but I have attempted to apologize for much of it and I am more interested in debating and discussing the LBH than I am in character assassination, personal attacks, and all the rest. My recent silence speaks for more than just being away from the Internet and Matron Merkel's starting a new chapter some three months after closing the last is uncalled for, in my opinion. I hope-- though I doubt-- this is the end of it. At least now, it is out in the open.
Thanks again, Clair.
Very best wishes, Fred.
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Op-Ed
Nov 20, 2008 16:09:37 GMT -5
Post by Gerry on Nov 20, 2008 16:09:37 GMT -5
Private Peter Thompson was shot at 14 times buy gun and once by arrow, one shot into the right arm and hand. Buy the sixth time he was taking fire he says,"but that did not trouble us, because we knew that the Indians when excited were very poor shot; and in our case the bullets went wide of the mark."..."was no longer terror to us>"
Then after that, someone personally attacks Thompson as he says," a loud voice from behind the bluff called to me in good English,"Come down here you white livered xxx xxxxxx and I will cut your heart out and drink your blood." The loud bleat of a sheep was the only answer I gave him."
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Op-Ed
Nov 21, 2008 2:51:08 GMT -5
Post by cisdyd on Nov 21, 2008 2:51:08 GMT -5
Strange, not everything revolves around you. Most of us understand the Indian Wars to have been a clash of cultures, i.e. free-roaming vs. land owning. We all know that both sides mutilated, the Indians more so than the Anglos.
As far as Custer is concerned, well he was an adequate commander but the savior of the American West, no way. Mackenzie, Hatch, whoever commanded the 2d Cav., Grierson and Merritt were all better commanders than GAC.
Frankly speaking, GAC was an aggressive commander who with seasoning may have become a damned good commander; unfortunately he was killed during his educational period.
Billy, A.K.A. Markland (plus you have never pasted me on any debate as you stated on any earlier post!)
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Op-Ed
Nov 21, 2008 11:18:17 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2008 11:18:17 GMT -5
Strange--
A word of advice from someone who likes you. Markland is one of the real "good guys" around here or anywhere else. He is also the best Western history researcher in the land. No bull, the best. He knows his stuff and when he gives you information, just jot it down for future reference; you can be sure it is the best available. And no one pastes him in a debate.
Best wishes, Fred.
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Op-Ed
Nov 22, 2008 9:01:44 GMT -5
Post by strange on Nov 22, 2008 9:01:44 GMT -5
Strange, not everything revolves around you. Most of us understand the Indian Wars to have been a clash of cultures, i.e. free-roaming vs. land owning. We all know that both sides mutilated, the Indians more so than the Anglos. As far as Custer is concerned, well he was an adequate commander but the savior of the American West, no way. Mackenzie, Hatch, whoever commanded the 2d Cav., Grierson and Merritt were all better commanders than GAC. Frankly speaking, GAC was an aggressive commander who with seasoning may have become a damned good commander; unfortunately he was killed during his educational period. Billy, A.K.A. Markland (plus you have never pasted me on any debate as you stated on any earlier post!) I know Mackenzie, I like him alot. I'd like to ask you one question, what more could Custer have accomplished in his life time? Youngest American General? Participant in virtually every major battle from Civil War to the Indian conflicts (the major battles to happen in his lifetime at least)? He's one of the best book keepers, some one who writes down everything with detail and precision and leaves no stone unturned. A trait which would've saved the lives of many Indian fighters, if they had only bothered to communicate, communicate and document, so that a tighter eye can be placed on the Indians and what they are doing. Custer's death could've been bypassed if a few authorities (from Crook and others) had paid more attention toward transferring their current experiences to the parties that need the information. And of coarse, a lot of you (speaking respectfully your educated ideas of commander) don't really enjoy how Custer leads from the front. This is a subject of agree and disagree and alot of people who think Custer is being brash. But I love that he leads from the front. He sets an example to his men that he'll be going down with the ship if his strategies fail, but most importantly...... Custer always has the best eye for whats going on around him, he places himself right in the heat so he knows no one is slacking under fire and he gets a unique sense of what the Indians are like when they are damnwell directly in front of you. If you want experience, Custer has it. Because Custer saw all of the tricks and all of their skills, and he saw it from a soldiers perspective so that they could learn. There were many enlisted men who were really sloppy. Men so ignorant of Indians, that they'll react very un-soberly at the very sight of a native. Maybe they get intimidated by the feathers, or the nakedness, or the face paint.... or maybe they are intimidated by the heavily armed effectiveness of each native..... or maybe they suddenly find themselves ensnared into one of those tricky old Indian traps, maybe the grass is burning around them and the Indians are swarming in numbers they aren't supposed to have! Custer was face to face with all of this, and he was among some of the first guys to document what a soldier is gonna meet inside the shuffle of and Indian warzone. His words, and you can even see them from "My Life on The Plains", are a screw tightener. Thats why Custer's soldiers were drilled and disciplined and practiced and lectured into well oiled combatants. Because Custer knew how many firearms you can expect from each native, he knew and he survived many of the deadly tricks they pulled out on Fetterman, and he knew how not to lose his head. And he was highly successful in every task which he functioned in his lifetime. Meaning to say, at least for me, he died early and the Indian wars still had many battles to go. Crook himself had opportunities to carve a name higher than Custer, because he was in there much longer. I didn't think Crook was half the commander that Custer was. Crook might be aggressive, but he's a whiner and he's sloppy. Crook does like Mcclellan and demands an unlimited supply of soldiers, and then he makes sloppy hits. Strange
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Op-Ed
Nov 23, 2008 12:20:52 GMT -5
Post by boston on Nov 23, 2008 12:20:52 GMT -5
Strange, I don’t know you. But I have a gut feeling that you have an insight into this matter; that lays far beyond the scope of those whose prejudices give way to their words. They fail to step back 1 step and say, I will give each man who participated at the LBH an equal chance, and not look for fault nor guilt. That’s where they have to begin, and for some to go back and start all over again; its just not an option.
I believe, no; I know, your assessment of Custer is correct. But to find that out I had to put to rest once and for all my own petty prejudices, and my own pride in what I thought I knew.
One word of caution though. I did say, each man! Whether that be Reno, Benteen, Crazy Horse or Sitting Bull, or the other thousands who participated. One cannot find what is hidden until you view them equally, not at guilt nor fault because of their race color or creed.
Boston
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Op-Ed
Nov 23, 2008 13:21:18 GMT -5
Post by strange on Nov 23, 2008 13:21:18 GMT -5
Strange, I don’t know you. But I have a gut feeling that you have an insight into this matter; that lays far beyond the scope of those whose prejudices give way to their words. They fail to step back 1 step and say, I will give each man who participated at the LBH an equal chance, and not look for fault nor guilt. That’s where they have to begin, and for some to go back and start all over again; its just not an option. I believe, no; I know, your assessment of Custer is correct. But to find that out I had to put to rest once and for all my own petty prejudices, and my own pride in what I thought I knew. One word of caution though. I did say, each man! Whether that be Reno, Benteen, Crazy Horse or Sitting Bull, or the other thousands who participated. One cannot find what is hidden until you view them equally, not at guilt nor fault because of their race color or creed. Boston Thats a great way to look at all history. Thats actually how I came to Custer in the first place. For years I had alot of worldly people and worldly images that portrayed Custer in a very shameful light. And then finally, after watching "Little Big Man" for about the tenth time and seeing "Custer" freak out with a mental break down, I thought I should have a look at the books and see things for myself. And sure enough, Custer became one of my favorite war heroes and I renewed my childhood fascination with Union Generals of the Civil War, combined with even yet a new fascination for Indian fighters and wild west stuff. And I went on to read about other figures which society had shamed, and many of them gave me the same result. Then I realized that many of these were people who have had a place in my heart from the very beginning, but they were people which the damnedly world had deprived me of. And so it came to pass that I was enriched, not with Kennedy, but with Nixon, not with Abbie Hoffman, but with Jimmy Hoffa! And that was just the way I hobbled along. Sir Boston, a round of applause I send to you! Its wonderful to have fresh souls coming along! Strange
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Op-Ed
Nov 23, 2008 14:22:04 GMT -5
Post by boston on Nov 23, 2008 14:22:04 GMT -5
In fairness to fred, who I admire greatly, as he said in one of his other pieces, paraphrasing: I don’t want him nor anyone else to take offense at what I have said. And as I believe, he, and perhaps a few others may be away for the holiday; would prefer not to say anything they can themselves not deny nor refute by debate.
Strange: I know exactly what your saying. I had the most terrible time trying to let go of my personal opinions & prejudices of Custer, Reno and Benteen. Each it seemed had done something wrong, and yet, something just didn’t seem to fit with that hypothesis. It took me over 20 years of difficult soul searching research to finally find the answers. Not that I know them all, mind you. And heaven forbid if I think that of myself!!! I realize what fred said in one of his last pieces, and yes it does seem like “recalcitrance” on my part. But if it was, why would I try to share, in whole or part, anything here? As I said, we all have “set” views of what we believe happened. The trick here is not get sucked into believing it is set in stone in ones’ own mind. Some of these things are so ridiculous that it borders on the absurd, I know. But lying somewhere within that absurd, sometimes, just sometimes lies a glint of truth that others refuse to see, because the “whole” thing is absurd to even consider in the first place. For instance, Custer being killed at the river. It seems so much is not known about it, that not one person can discuss with any reliable certainty and produce any viable evidence; to even suggest that some of Custer and his men ever arrived there in the first place. But instead, they choose or prefer to discuss personal preferences based upon… what?
I can see what fred means, and he means well, when he refuses to even discuss Custer’s possible demise at the river, and I respect that. But all I ask of this community at large is: Did he even get there, to the river? And if he did, provide the evidence before discussing whether or not he got shot or even possibly killed there.
Fred, I know you are away, and I am NOT saying anything here that should offend. And if I did, please accept my apologies in advance.
Thank you strange for your comments. I find your style and substance of great interest. And it is refreshing to find someone who agrees with a few of my views. Though, as always, I’m sure we will disagree on future issues. Lets just agree to disagree and leave it at that.
Best wishes: Boston
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